202. Peter McDonell aka fontpharos@woodysw... (gosax2-024.dialup.optusnet.com.a) –
03 May 2002 18:56:02
[ UPD: Embed / DMCA threats ]
I had not heard of the "Embed" program before this brouhaha. Now I think there is a storng possibility that millions are aware of it, thanks to the legal threats to keep it quiet. Let's hear it for the lawyers. |
| |
Yes, can't wait to hack. Please post immediately. |
| |
Tom,
I'm 100% behind you. I think these lawyers actually look for potential issues to justify their existence.
I read about this story today on cnet.com. I immediately searched for your site and downloaded embed. Not because I intend to use it, but because I want to have a copy in case the legal bastards force you to remove it. I did the same with deCSS.
Ironically, by threatening this legal action, this legal idiots will ensure that your program lives on.
If you ever need donations for legal fees, I'll be glad to contribute.
|
| |
lol i want to watch killer robots at school, but the Hick's here don't understand the time and luven effort that was put into the design of the robots. I'm mad and because of this i'm going to post the school's IP. Yes hack all you want lol. This is because the school has a soild IP, and you have lots of time to hack it. |
| |
Good luck with this, tom. I've been a big fan of your fonts (and other works) for many years now... If this does (somehow) go to court, and you setup a paypal account to help with court fees, i'll gladly contribute.
Oh, and I still wear my tombats shirt occasionally. :D
..And TZ, only bitmap fonts are non-copyrightable, i believe... |
| |
Agfa - this is great PR.
I'll switch my camera film too!!
Elephant brain |
| |
As someone who works with a number of design firms, and always pays the licensing fees for fonts, let me tell you:
1. Thank you, for standing up to these bullies who have misguided lawyers and are contributing to the nonsense created by the DMCA.
2. I will be specifying, from this point forward, than none of my projects, nor any of my clients projects, use typefaces from Agfa Monotype.
To the designers of the world: stop purchasing their products, and let them know this type of action is why... maybe in the future companies will think twice about frivolous legal action against legitimate tools and users. |
| |
Hi Tom, why don't you make publicly accessible the visitor statistics for your legal letter page.
This way silly corporations can see how much bad PR is being generated from their scare tactics.
Keep up the good work. Oh by the way, I'm never buying an Agfa font ever again! |
| |
Hey Tom,
Thank you for the simple act of standing up to a bully. Hope and inspiration for the common person sometimes spring from the smallest act.
http://www.freedomforum.org/packages/first/curricula/educationforfreedom/supportpages/L01-RosaParks.htm |
| |
Great job, Tom! Another good piece of evidence on how the DMCA is used to bully legitimate expression. |
| |
You might also ask them if their own designers have tools which can modify these bits, and whether, if so, they believe these tools to be legal.
:)
|
| |
I'm impressed, Tom. Truly brilliant. |
| |
I hate yo all so very much
|
| |
Yikes!
I guess radar.spacebar.org is the #1 discussion site for Killer Japanese Seizure robots in the world! |
| |
They are too small for windows, unless you're making dollhouses or something. I mostly just smash them up. |
| |
187. Tom 7 (gs82.sp.cs.cmu.edu) –
02 May 2002 18:16:35
[ FLAMING TEXT ]
Not sure why this is spam central, but oh well! |
| |
All I have to say is "BRAVO!!" I must say that your arguments are laid out beautifully to attack the allegations in the C&D letter. I wish you the best of luck! -Bob |
| |
185. Hock (cmu-29070.wv.cc.cmu.edu) –
02 May 2002 13:23:42
[ Slashdotted... ]
I think you are thinking of this story, not Tom's:
http://slashdot.org/yro/02/05/01/1348256.shtml |
| |
Good page. Good fight. Stand up to 'em. |
| |
Hi Tom,
First, thanks for having the balls to stand up to these
idiots. It goes without saying that you're absolutely
right and that they have no case at all. I noticed your
reply, above, discouraging people from contacting the
parties involved to complain about their tactics; I'm
assuming you meant the law firm itself. If you meant
Agfa, I respectfully disagree -- unless people (specifically
their customers) let them know that what they are doing
is objectionable, there's no reason to think they will
ever understand the errors of their ways. I, for one,
submitted a comment on AGFA's website saying in no uncertain
terms that I found their conduct in this matter to be
arrogant, asinine, and incredibly short-sighted -- and that
I would never do any further business with them again. |
| |
Last I heard FONTS ARE NOT COPYRIGHTABLE. I don't know if something has changed in the last few years, but there was a court case on the particular issue if the bitmaps or splines or whatever could be copyrighted, and it was found that the mathematical description or shapes could not be copyrighted. The only IP protection for a font is a trademark on the typeface name, e.g. Helvetica or New Century Schoolbook, or even Times (remember Swiss and Dutch typefaces in some packages from long ago?).
That said, the programs are, and if you buy fonts or such a program, there might be a license that prohibits flipping bits, or might prohibit the use of programs like embed, but that is a different issue. |
| |
Tom, that was very brave of you not to submit to the
threats of AGFA and the likes. I feel scared of the
tendency that shows in the USA. When the corporate
ambitions and the greed for money can produce such
ridiculous laws as the DMCA (or slated to be born the
CBDTPA). And the question of the source code to be
a form speech is not relevant any more. Because laws
state that if your speech poses a risk to their profits
(be it disclose of their trade secrets or some other
junk like their thought-to-be control on the embedding
of the fonts) then they can stifle anyone. And the sad
example of DeCSS shows that a tool that can be used
inappropriately casts a great danger to its creator. And
the arguments of legal use of such a tool have no reasoning
power on judges. The thing that strikes me to death is
absolute ignorance of the rights granted by the
First Amendment. What one can say if a person gets sued
for the comments he posted to the message board where he
expressed his own _opinion_ about lousy way of doing
business with customers.
As for your particular case, I was shocked (as I always am
when I hear similar stories)! They demand you to remove
the program from your web-site although they provide
no evidence of your infringing their copyrights. And the
thing that makes me really baffled is that your tool
is needed for font creator to set embedding bits
(hey! he is _creator_). So how one will set level of
embedding? Use the Micro$oft's "Font properties extension"
tool? Well, its possible but people have a right to use an
alternative if they want! And the fact that specification
of TrueType fonts is available freely makes the whole
case absurd.
I do hope that you will be a winner in this situation
and you will set a precedent for future so that human
rights won't be oppressed in favor of someone's folly greed.
with regards,
Sergei. |
| |
Why not just modify embed.c to detect when the font is a product of Agfa/ITC, and refuse to change the bits? That ought to make them happy . Of course, if anyone then takes that version of embed.c and hacks it to remove the detection, *you* could sue *them* via the DMCA. |
| |
Tom,
I just zipped off an email to AGFA, saying that I and my clients won't do business w/ them until they stop hounding you. Nevermind, that I haven't purchased new fonts in 5 years, but what the heck, I might buy some... it just won't be from them!
Good Luck!
-Choi Kwok |
| |
Tom,
Just wanted to say that I greatly appreciate your effort. As a slashdot reader from Europe, you are the kind of person one needs to remember that there is Hope for the U.S. and therefore for Europe as well.
Because sooner or later, we (EU) will start emulating the legislative sillyness in a quest for Mo' Money for Icky Big Corporations and Ze Stripping Of Ze Power From Ze People.
Cheers,
Chris Winter |
| |